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Competitive Improv: Lessons from the Thunderdome

Competitive Improv: Lessons From the Thunderdome

Hello, NAmaniacs!

As I’m sure you all know, last Wednesday we conquered the Thunderdome, winning the headliner spot for the June show.  It was our first time competing as a team, and an experience dramatically different from any other improv show I’ve been in.  We really wanted to win, because we’re really dedicated to making this whole crazy N/A thing work.  Competing against a different improv group means you’ve got to play a little differently, and think very differently.  Here are the major things I learned after stepping out of the Thunderdome and thinking on it a bit.

 

1.  Strategize for the format.

Going into Thunderdome, we knew exactly what we were getting into.  I went to two of them previously, and most of the team saw at least one.  We knew that both teams got 20-minute sets, voting was done after the second team’s set, and whoever won the opening bout of Categories (called “Thunderdome,” which is gonna get too confusing for the purposes of this blog post) got to pick who went first.  So, we drilled Categories (in a way counter to the normal thinking, more on that in a bit) and made sure we went second, right before the vote.  Sure, the partisans (more on them coming, too) will more or less vote for who they’re going to vote for, but going right before the vote keeps your scenes and jokes fresh in the neutral crowd members’ minds, and if you close it out well, the rush will influence their voting.

We also styled our set to fit into the 20-minute restriction, going with a Harold—which sounds crazy, but, actually isn’t (and we proved it!).  We spent weeks getting our Harolds down to 20 minutes, and ended up doing it in about 18 for the actual set.  The Harold works because seeing long(ish) form setups and resolutions is always satisfying, and when you emphasize that you’ve chosen a challenging format (which I did, as I was getting the suggestion), it’s all the more satisfying for the audience when they see you succeed.  The other two winners I’ve seen (local powerhouses Moosehead and 15 Minutes) also used longer styles, and I wouldn’t be surprised if most ‘Dome winners used longer styles.  Formats focused on lots of short scenes are tougher to pull off in a setting like the Thunderdome, because you have to keep going to the audience for suggestions, there’s no through-line for the audience to focus on nor for the improvisers to anchor to, and unless you’re the best improv troupe in the history of the planet, you are going to have a hit-and-miss set.  When you throw more jokes out, that means that you also have more jokes that might fall flat, and if you don’t have character or narrative arcs to guide you, it’s easy to panic when you see time running out.  So: stay cool, stay long, and practice.  Which brings us to

 

2. Make your team look good—and let the other guys help themselves.

Yes, I know.  I know!  It’s one of the cardinal rules of improv, and probably the only one that normally you never want to break.  But, in a setup like the Thunderdome, you’re competing for a pretty serious prize.  You shouldn’t try to make the other team look bad.  That’s a horrible thing to do, and professionally, it’s pretty disgusting too.  However, you shouldn’t go out of your way to make the other team look better than you, because all that will do is lose the show for you.  The thing this affects most is the Categories bout.  Normally, since the “teams” are really just two halves of the troupe, you “take bullets” and manipulate the flow of the “competition” so that it puts on the best show, not really caring which side “wins.”  For the ‘Dome, you still want to entertain, absolutely, and you want to put on a good show, absolutely, but you do not want to take bullets.  Don’t throw out something you know will get DQ’d by the audience, and do not take yourself out.  You do that in the ‘Dome, and you’re gonna lose your chance to set up whether you go first or not, and you’re gonna make the other team seem funnier, smarter, and quicker on their feet than you are.

Another instance of this came when the other team, graciously and kindly, invited us to take part in a game they had invented which required a lot of bodies.  We agreed, it was a lot of fun for both teams, and I think we made a great scene together.  But, immediately, I knew it was probably a bad idea on their part, strategically, because it: gave us more stage time; made us look like the polite ones for coming out and helping; & it took focus away from their performance.  If you want to win, you shouldn’t share the spotlight during your own set.  You have to keep your set yours, and use it for what it is: a 20-minute chance to show the audience your absolute best.  Showcasing other improvisers is great improv behavior under normal circumstances, but in a competition, you’re just doing yourself a disservice.  The crowd isn’t voting on which team made the other team seem the most entertaining, they’re voting on which team was the most entertaining.  However, if the other team doesn’t think of this, and does invite you out during their set?  Do it like we did it: pretend it’s not a competition while you’re out there, and just focus on doing good improv.  Try to make them look good, and try to put on a fun & interesting scene.  It’s their set, and they’re inviting you to be a part of it.  Respect that.  Speaking of the crowd, though,

 

3. Pack the house, and sway the rest.

One uncomfortable truth about the ‘Dome is that it is partly a popularity—or, maybe, a marketing—contest.  If you bring diehard fans, friends, and family, you have some guaranteed (hopefully) votes.  Having those is a critical factor in success; if you don’t bring anybody, you’re pretty much guaranteed a loss,  because the other guys are gonna bring people.

Unless you’re both already massively popular, though, neither of you is probably going to bring enough people to pack the house on a Wednesday (and, really, if you can sell out a venue the size of Stagewerx anyway, you’re a bit like a Major Leaguer pissing on a Little League game, don’t you think?  Maybe not.  Argue in the comments.).  Plus, you get people who are fans of the headliners, or just fans of the production company in general, attending as well, and even a few randos off the street.  Bringing friends isn’t enough—it’s huge, but not enough.  You’ve gotta sway the neutrals, too.  That means you can’t tailor the show to your friends, you’ve got to keep in-jokes under control, and—and this is a subtle one—you really should try to take a suggestion from someone who isn’t there just to support you.  Treat the audience members who aren’t your friends like they’re just as important as your friends—because they are.

 

Phew.  Those are the biggest lessons, I think.  Competitive improv is very interesting; in order to win, you’ve got to alter some of the really fundamental ways of thinking about how to put a set and a show together.  You shouldn’t behave like cynical monsters, but if you really want to win—and we have wanted nothing more badly than this for three months now—then you have to be a little less charitable, and a little more self-serving, than you normally would be.  It’s not something I want to do a lot, because it does feel a bit wrong, you know?  Setting out to defeat another group of hard-working enthusiastic improvisers by proving you’re better than they are…that’s not what improv is really “about.”  And it felt a little uncomfortable to “win,” because it’s uncomfortable to see other improv troupes fail or be hurt by your own successes.  But, it is fun to do in small doses, and very fun to watch in large doses.  It’s a fantastic way to see a wide variety of improvisers and styles in one sitting.  If you haven’t seen Thunderdome or something like it, you really should.  And if you haven’t done Thunderdome or something like it, you really should.  The challenge of doing your best ever stuff in just 20 minutes is pretty thrilling, and if you’ve got the opportunity to grab a prize than can help move your group up in the world, why not do it?

Just, you know.

Don’t try and go against us.

:P

 

Cheers,

Frankie G.

16 Responses to Competitive Improv: Lessons from the Thunderdome

  • Daniel Burt says:

    As someone who has done a few competitive improv sets the two biggest things I have learned are these:

    1) Don’t compete. Just play your show. If winning is on your brain then you aren’t truly playing. Don’t get me wrong we all want to win but if you are thinking about winning you are probably too concentrated on the quality of the show. Whether the audience is laughing or not, how much the audience cheered for the other team and not you and other crap like that. If you are focused on winning you probably aren’t being in the moment in your show and not putting your best show out there. So as hard as it can be I try to put winning out of my mind and just playing. I just assume we will lose before hand so I can just go out there and play.

    2) Don’t watch the other team. I got that advice years ago from an amazing performer and person, Barry Hite. It makes a lot of sense because even if you aren’t trying to compete and you just want to play there is no way you can’t hear all the laughs and good time moments that the other team has put out there. Sure if they stink it up you will get confidence but that is a chance you are taking watching the other groups. Better to just go out back or upstairs or wherever and just have some fun with your team. That way you can go into your show with a clean slate.

    Those are the two things I have learned over the years from competitive improv. Not saying those things work for everyone but personally those things help me have more fun and do better competitive shows.

    Great job by NA last wed!

    • frankieg says:

      That is some really awesome advice, thank you! We definitely were nervously listening to the other team’s whole set, focusing on both of those “don’t”s, and we had to work to reset our frames of mind as we headed out for our own.

      Thanks! You guys did great too–my mom even Yelped about you.

      • Daniel Burt says:

        Your mom was there?! and She liked our show?! Your mom is pretty hip! We said some just awful things :)

        • Daniel Burt says:

          PS I love improv talk so keep blogging and I will keep nerding out.

          • frankieg says:

            Excellent! & yes, she was, my parents came up to support us, but I think they’re starting to get hooked on improv! Soon they’ll be coming to the City and snubbing our shows to see other troupes.

            As for the awful things, as long as they’re awfully funny, my mom will pretty much laugh at it. :)

            • Elbrns says:

              I don’t understand why This American Life put so much neivagte spin on their Improv Everywhere segment. When this show first aired last year, I wrote to them and expressed disappointment about what they did and asked them why they did it. They didn’t respond, so I still don’t understand why they decided to tilt the whole IE segment toward the moon instead of the sun!IE is not a mean-spirited group. I had read about the two missions TAL spun neivagtely prior to hearing the radio show, and the TAL spin came as a complete surprise. Although I have no connection with IE, I know someone who participated in the Ghost of Pasha event. The first hand account I heard months before the radio show aired was a positive one that backed up the old belief that if you expend energy to become a better audience, you will get a better show. It’s like Newton’s third law action/reaction. Television producers use this behavior principle by hiring audience warm-up guys to work the crowd and get them pumped up before taping a show.What I heard at the time was that the audience energy pushed Pasha to perform their best, and everyone enjoyed the concert. Nobody made fun of anybody, even though their attendance was planned to surprise the band. What might have been a deadly dull Sunday night concert with a handful of attendees turned into a happening and resulted in a lot of publicity for the band. The TAL reported “trauma” suffered by a band member? I just don’t get it. Pasha and IE seem to be on good terms now, and I can’t imagine a performer being traumatized by a good gig.TAL primed their audience for the IE segment with dark, ominous music. One of TAL’s classic comical segments is a story about a burning squirrel, so they fully understand that we can either laugh or be outraged at just about anything if they cue us with sound effects and then tell us what they want to tell us in the style they want us to hear. Who knows why TAL made the choice they did, but it shows that reporters and producers can serve up a story any way they want to manipulate our reactions. Listeners believe what they hear. TAL is an entertainment program and their objective is to manipulate listeners’ feelings. I just don’t understand why they didn’t have more fun with this segment. Rather than jump on the “shame on you” bandwagon, people should read the original accounts on this site. They’re very funny and are clearly not mean spirited.

        • Jaci Griffen says:

          Ha ha – where do you think Frankie G got his awesome sense of humor from? Hard to shock me… and you guys were pretty funny – I laughed pretty hard at the devil’s abortion tie in at the end..

  • PeterK says:

    Absolutely love the energy and concentrated reflections y’all are bringing to the SF/EndGames scene.

    EndGames started as a competitive improv tournament and Thunderdome is a throwback to our roots. Competitive improv, at its best, is a simple guise for many different improvisers, styles and audiences to support and grow as a community.

    Winning’s important, sure, but my hope is that every team that enters Thunderdome comes out changed, and for the better. I hope that TDome can be a launch pad for new and old improv teams to produce the spark needed to become local “household” names in the SF, and that every team @ T-Dome (competitors and headliners) can network and do more, amazing improv together.

    Congratulations on your win and I’m looking forward seeing how N/A incorporates lessons learned at the Headliner set of the next T-Dome!

    • frankieg says:

      Thanks, man.

      This is the kind of guidance we need & are looking for! We’re very lucky to have people like you & Dan and all the EG folks to look up to and keep us grounded as we try to figure out this whole “being an improv troupe” thing. We’re definitely hoping to have DragonViperCobra involved in a comedy night in July that we’re putting together, and meeting other groups though EG has been invaluable.

      As for winning, haha, yeah, like I said, it feels weird to “win” at improv, but we’re really glad to have the chance to headline.

      Thanks a lot!

  • Stacy B says:

    Well thought-out post, Frankie and NA, (and great feedback as well, Peter and Dan). I’ll be joining my Endgames showcase team for the July Thunderdome and I’m really looking forward to it.

  • Jaci Griffen says:

    Really, you think we would snub NA – never I say never – parent guilt would be too overwhelming and I can’t afford to drown my guilt at Monk’s Kettle…

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